Should you practice to a metronome or click trak?

Hutnick · Post by **Hutnick** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:27 pm

Yes, Mr. Berlin is a phenomenal player, but still an assbag.

Opinionated? I don't know any opinionated bassists. I think you must be confusing them with banjo players.

sevesd93 · Post by **sevesd93** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:59 pm

kimaliz wrote:
sevesd93 wrote:Here is some advice, if your a drummer and can't play with a click, take two weeks off and quit. Time to find a new hobby.
that is very wrong.

How So? Drumming is about keeping time. If you can't keep time what good are you?

doubleshot · Post by **doubleshot** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:44 pm

I think you must be confusing them with banjo players.

DOH! That's got hurt the inbred dude's feelings from "Deliverance". I mean, assuming he's still around and playing river shows.

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:58 pm

Are you a drummer? If not then you must not know anything about it. You can be a good drummer and not be able to follow a click.

I am nowhere near the best drummer in town but I am a good drummer and I dont play to a click, it takes the natural feeling away from it in my opinion.

Post by **cwallace** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:04 pm

Oh god...let's not get Al in a drummer debate...because we will inevitably have to reitterate how bad he sucks at the game...and we don't want to go there...<duck>

Chris

P.S. I mean after all, look how many awards his band has won since he got extradited back to florida...

CW

sevesd93 · Post by **sevesd93** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:08 pm

Yes Al i am a drummer and a damn good one at that. If you can't follow a click you are not a drummer, you are just annoying all the people around you who can keep a beat.

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:56 pm

well that is your opinion.

a very pompous butthead opinion but its yours.

If I really wanted to I could get used to playing to a click again, i prefer the feel of not worrying about it.

Silencio · Post by **Silencio** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:04 pm

"So many drummers.... so little time."

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:19 pm

kimaliz wrote:"So many assholes.... so little time."

not directed at you of course

sevesd93 · Post by **sevesd93** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:21 pm

You sure do talk a lot when you are in Florida

sevesd93 · Post by **sevesd93** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:26 pm

Too bad your not living up here, we could put your theory to the test, and go head to head. I guess I have an unfair advantage though, because I have seen you with Pleasing Melani.

bassjones · Post by **bassjones** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:38 pm

Bonham
Buddy Rich
Ringo Starr
Ginger Baker
Carl Palmer
All the Motown Drummers!!!
Etc... Etc... Etc...

Fantastic drummers - No click track - Great "feel"

Frankly, to be musical, I think the time SHOULD fluctuate a little. Too much and it ceases to be musical, but if it's too locked to the metronome it gets robotic and loses the groove.

If you use a click in the studio for ProTools editing purposes, you need to learn how to push against the click and pull against the click - to make it feel less robotic - allot of this falls on the bass player as well. Pushing the one on the verse (or pulling it a little), then locking right onto it on the choruses can have a nice subtle effect. Another trick I like is the bass player playing on the "and" of 4 while the kick drum hits right on the one. It creates a nice tension - CAUTION, do not overdo it!

Point being, to simply say that not being able to play to a kick means you should take up a new hobby is at least silly, if not downright arrogant. And it's arrogance without knowledge, which is just about the worst combination of traits a musician can have. I've been playing 20 years and I'm still learning new things.

Silencio · Post by **Silencio** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:53 pm

kimaliz,

Please remove that altered quote. I said and would say nothing of the sort, and I don't want a casual reader of this thread to think I did or would. Besides, when referring to someone I find offensively self-important, I prefer the term "jackass." Not only does it have a great punchy sound, but it infers a loud, braying quality I find amusing.

"So many drummers, so little time," comes from a list of Things To Avoid Saying In A Recording Session compiled by Walter Becker of Steely Dan. It's a joke.

But this isn't a joke: A drummer who can't play in time sucks. It's just that simple. Being able to swing or play around the beat is NOT the same thing as not being able to play in straight time. Music that feels good does have minor - and that means MINOR - and intentional variations in the time. A drummer pushes, and pulls, makes things jazzy with a forward ride cymbal or makes things sound "big" by dragging the snare.

A drummer who can actually do these things can probably also play to a metronome. Saying something along the lines of "I've got too much soul to play in straight time" is a cop out. It the same as saying "I didn't learn to read music because it makes you less creative" or "I never ran scales because music is about e-MO-tion, maaahhhn."

Being able to play to a click is NOT the same as being "locked" to it.

bassjones · Post by **bassjones** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:57 pm

I recognized the quote, and now I get where you're coming from. The key to playing to click is hearing it as a percussion instrument, not a strict time-keeping device. Play around it, not on it.

Al Quandt · Post by **Al Quandt** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 5:02 pm

sevesd93 wrote:Too bad your not living up here, we could put your theory to the test, and go head to head. I guess I have an unfair advantage though, because I have seen you with Pleasing Melani.

http://www.myspace.com/pleasingmelani
Its not my most complicated work but its on time.

I dont get into drum battles, thats kinda dumb. Music isnt a competition its to make you and other feel better.

I have heard sh*tty drummers and yes most likely cannot play to a click track. They do sound like crap and it is the most annoying sound you ever heard.

But all drummers had a time like that. Most times i will sit through it too because i think its cool that someone is trying.

BTW do i know you?