On race...

[bassjones]

From my blog - www.xanga.com/bassjones - just thought I'd share.

Passion
So, by now you're all familiar with one of my main passions, which is music. You may not be as aware of my others, most of which kind of revolve around each other - and in some ways music as well.

I love sports almost as much as I love music, especially basketball, which I feel is the most graceful, athletic sport there is. I love football, baseball and hockey too, but basketball... there's just something about it. Maybe it's because it was my main sport in high school and I played two years in college, but I absolutely love the game.

Tied in with both basketball and music is a passion for racial justice (seems an odd choice for a social conservative I'm sure). To this end, I have coached in a summer basketball league run by our church, every summer for the past 5 years, taking last year off to concentrate on school. The league is for the forgotten age group of 18-28 year-old young men, most of whom are African American. I started out trying to "save" those young men - both spiritually and personally, but it turns out they are saving me as well, and in much the same way.

Many of those young men have been in the league all 5 years, and many of them have become friends and men I admire and respect a great deal. Many of them have had to overcome much in life already at fairly young ages. A fairly large percentage of them were raised in poverty by single mothers and many of them barely know their fathers, if at all. They have been repeatedly taught that they are of no value to society unless they are playing sports or performing for us in some other entertainment venue. They have been shuffled into inferior schools where poor black male children are consistently labeled as "special needs" or "at risk" at a rate nearly 3x's that of their Caucasian female peers, by teachers who are overwhelmingly Caucasian, overwhelmingly female, and overwhelmingly from upper middle class families of origin. Many of these teachers are clueless about black culture and poverty and many have been feministized (militant feminism that views masculinity as bad and attempts to train the masculinity out of males) to the point that they despise these young men more than they care to admit - or worse perhaps, they pity them. More of my feelings on that in a later post - for now, let's focus on the mountain of obstacles laid in the path of young, African-American males.

Given all these obstacles, and many more, is it any wonder that so many are in prison? I think it's a wonder that more of them aren't. Is it any wonder that the hurricane of poverty continues to eat up so many African-Americans in its path?

Solutions? I don't know. I used to think we had the answers; I used to think I had the answers. At this point, I really don't know. I believe the first answer lies in creating an environment where young men are raised by their fathers, or at the very least have strong father figures in their life. We can't expect them to automatically know how to be a man. They need men to show them the way. And despite the fact that I love working with them and love being around them, I believe they need more black men to show them the way, especially black men who've come out of their type of situation. As much as I love them and have tried to understand, I was raised by Ozzie and Harriet in a middle class neighborhood with middle class friends who were mostly also being raised by Ozzie and Harriet. I know what it's like to struggle a little, but I have no idea what it's like to struggle and face systemic oppression and systemic racism on a daily basis. I know how to be a man (I think), but I honestly have very little idea how to become a man when faced with those kinds of obstacles. All I can do is be there and listen and support them in their struggle. I've learned to offer a lot less advice and criticism and listen more. Maybe that's the first step. More on this later...

[WBOB]

Nice Post!

... I'm not smart enough to have a solution either,..

but judging by what you stating, a common denominator
seems to be lack of a male "father figure" type in most
of these young men's lives. (that's color aside)

Like you, I grew up in the O&H neighborhood too, so
I can't start to imagine what they go through..

[QWETTY]

I believe the first answer lies in creating an environment where young men are raised by their fathers, or at the very least have strong father figures in their life. We can't expect them to automatically know how to be a man

BANG ANSWER....

Given all these obstacles, and many more, is it any wonder that so many are in prison? I think it's a wonder that more of them aren't.

father figure usually means disipline... disipline usually means morals.... morals usually mean less criminal activity...

there lies the answer. I go to northrop high school where there is a large minority of blacks. I am friends w/ many and whom I know do not know their father or have nothing to do with him. Not that a mother figure is weaker and cannot teach disipline...but more kids (male) will listen to a father. If this is because of fear or because of the fact that it is another male, i dont know. But it is what i see on a daily basis at school.

Some kind of father figure is very important to kids, even though they don't realize it.

(i have a problem with offending ppl sometimes on accident, and i hope this didnt for any reason... i cant see a reason it would, but just to be on the safe side, i appologize if I did)

[sharkmansix]

there lies the answer. I go to northrop high school where there is a large minority of blacks. I am friends w/ many and whom I know do not know their father or have nothing to do with him. Not that a mother figure is weaker and cannot teach disipline...but more kids (male) will listen to a father. If this is because of fear or because of the fact that it is another male, i dont know. But it is what i see on a daily basis at school.

I think you're generalizing too much here. I didn't have any respect for my father but I think the world of my mother. I was never fearful of my father nor did he teach me any form of discipline.

I think every situation is different and just having a father around doesn't assure you of anything.

[QWETTY]

oo im not trying to generalize... these are ppl i actually know. and those are the actual facts about them.

no a father doesnt always help, in fact it can hurt things more sometimes. I am just saying if MORE of them ahd a father figure (like bassjones is playing for many in the basketball program) then maybe there wouldnt be as big of problems.

EDIT - dammit- by 'them' i mean "ppl without a father figure who grew up poorer and had to face racial tention"

ppl flip out if you EVER use the word them when referring to anyone who isnt white.

[WBOB]

I think every situation is different and just having a father around doesn't assure you of anything

True,

But still helps to round
you out as a human being,...
(since a young child is a "born imitator",.. when they're
older they'll mostly draw back to whatever role model
they had at the time, be it father or mother)

[Oliver's Army]

QWETTY.

Please spell out P E O P L E.

It detracts from the sincerity of your post.

[zenmandan]

Nice post bassjones. Good for you for trying to make a difference. Most of us aren't that strong to actually go out and try to make a difference.

After reading your post I thought of an interesting point. My wife works with Healthy Families. She goes to peoples homes and helps them to understand different developmental stages of their children and how to help the parents be more involved than they already are in teaching their children, since the parents are the childs first teacher. Anyway, she made a good point one weekend when we were in a crowded Walmart. One of her Hispanic co-workers, "Maria", brought up the point that African-American and Hispanic FAMILIES help to raise the children, where as in white families, only the parents typically get involved in dicipline. What brought up the subject was a young white girl with her family in the mall who started having a temper tantrum. She yelled and screamed and eventually laid down on the hard tile floor and began slamming her head into the tile, just to get her way. Maria said that you will never see a black or Hispanic child throw a tantrum in public like that. The grandma, uncle, or older cousin three times removed would step in and dicipline the child. We witnessed this behavior several times that afternoon. A white kid wants something, the parents say no, the kid throws a fit. A black or Hispanic kid wants something, the parents say no, the kid starts to complain and someone says "didn't you hear your momma, she said no!" or something to that effect. All of the minority children that we saw in Walmart and in the mall and wherever else we have gone since then, I've noticed, have been pretty well behaved. The white kids are the ones throwing fits all the time. Just look at how a minority male respects not only his mother, but his aunt, his grandma and so on.

My point here is this: what happens in between an entire family helping to raise a young toddler/child and adolescence/late teens. What happens that so many of these minority men are getting involved in or at least being associated with the wrong activities? From what I've seen out and about, "Maria's" statement is basically true. So what really happens between an entire family/community helping to raise the young ones and teach them right, to later in life. Is one single male roll model the answer? I don't know.

[sharkmansix]

But still helps to round
you out as a human being,...
(since a young child is a "born imitator",.. when they're
older they'll mostly draw back to whatever role model
they had at the time, be it father or mother)

If I had imitated my father I'd be an embezzling drunk who couldn't keep a job. It all depends on the role model.

no a father doesnt always help, in fact it can hurt things more sometimes. I am just saying if MORE of them ahd a father figure (like bassjones is playing for many in the basketball program) then maybe there wouldnt be as big of problems.

Once again I see generalizing. Having an afterschool program does not mean anything will change. Hell it could be the rendezvous point for all the kids to do more bad behavior.

IMHO it's more then just a 'father figure' or a 'mother figure' it's a role model. Sex and race doesn't matter it just needs to be positive.

[WBOB]

for sake of clarification....

it just needs to be positive

...that was implied,.. Sorry.

[heaven's chimney]

Given all these obstacles, and many more, is it any wonder that so many are in prison? I think it's a wonder that more of them aren't. Is it any wonder that the hurricane of poverty continues to eat up so many African-Americans in its path?

it sounds like you're blaming female teachers for taking away their masculinity. and yet, by your own accord, a lot of black people go to jail (while I assume less white people go to jail) - if female teachers are teaching all "races," why aren't more people in jail?


i dig your archaeology, but i think this particular post has left out a LOT more of the picture - systematic brutality by the government (last I checked, no KKK members have been government assassinated, and yet Black Panthers have), media portrayal, institutional racism ad infinitum.


as far as black males acting as role models for black males, no doubt. but i think there's a better middleground than Bill Cosby and 50 Cent.


(On a tangent, it sounds like you're blaming women instead of men for men's absence. That's how I take it anyways)

Please spell out P E O P L E

Guy, please quit being so pedantic. It's ridiculous and alienating - not to mention that you are, via self-fulfulling prophecy, detracting from his post.

[QWETTY]

seriously stop saying im generalizing... im trying not to, and anything anyone sais can be considered "generalizing" in this politically correct (which i view as incorrect) world we live in now.

and... i never said anything about an after school program... I was using bassjones as an example in that he "COULD" be playing a father-figure to them.

Yes sex/race matters. How can you say it doesnt? People need to be able to relate to someone. For me, it would be hard to relate to a 97 year old mexican woman. Is that racist? of course not, its the truth!

[sharkmansix]

seriously stop saying im generalizing...

I'll stop when you stop generalizing.

and... i never said anything about an after school program... I was using bassjones as an example in that he "COULD" be playing a father-figure to them.

And I was using that to elaborate on my point. "like bassjones is playing for many in the basketball program" lead me to the afterschool comment.

For me, it would be hard to relate to a 97 year old mexican woman.

It might be hard but it's not impossible. Have you tried? For all you know the two of you have similar interests.

[Oliver's Army]

Guy, please quit being so pedantic. It's ridiculous and alienating - not to mention that you are, via self-fulfulling prophecy, detracting from his post

Big words frighten me.



Lighten up, Frances, its just an observation.

[sharkmansix]

f'ing sweet 'Stripes' reference!